This Is Awful, But Give It Time

This is a terrible, retch-inducing image and worse. But give it time. Trump may have better instincts than Obama.

Is there value in President Trump meeting with Kim Jong-un? Images would dictate that this is the single most distasteful meeting since Chamberlain met the Fuhrer in Munich in 1938, or since Roosevelt sat with Stalin at Yalta.

It's truly disgusting. Kim wanted a place on the world stage, standing as an equal with America, and he got everything he wanted, tied with a big Trumpian bow.

But do we throw away the possibility of a successful outcome because of this? I'll ask again: is there value in the personal relationship?

The agreement that came out of the meeting is weak tea, I'll admit. We've had stronger documents with North Korea, which they summarily ignored.

The sideshow of Trump's press conference should make South Korea very nervous. The president indicated he'd stop joint military exercises with the Republic of Korea's army.

This is more than troubling, since the ROK Army is very much intwined into American forces in its command and control structure, operations, and even manpower. KATUSAs (Korean Augmentees to the U.S. Army) serve in American units, similar to the "purple suiters" at NATO. Would Reagan have promised Gorbachev that NATO would stop exercises in West Germany? That's what Trump just did.

But give it time. On the left, all Obama's cheerleaders thought the Arab Spring was a wonderful thing, until it wasn't. They thought withdrawing from Iraq was the end of terror, until ISIS. They thought the Iran deal would keep Iran from developing nukes, until they found out Iran never really stopped developing nukes.

Obama did very little to stop North Korea from pursuing nuclear weapons, despite rounds of talks, agreements, half-measures, and half-half-measures. Basically he did what other president have done: kicked the can down the road.

Trump took the can and opened it. Now that Kim has gotten what he desired, this could either go like what happened in Munich, 1939 (Hitler reportedly said "Angels have come from heaven and given us a gift!" when he learned Chamberlain was personally coming to visit him), or it could go like Reagan's continuing negotiations with Gorbachev, leading to the fall of the Soviet Union.

We know North Korea is the worst nation on Earth.

But what should we do? Nothing? Spill the lives of a million soldiers and civilians? Start a nuclear war? What Trump did is bile-inducing and distasteful. His style and substance of pissing on our allies and friends while obsequiously glad-handing evil murderers is gross. However, beyond that, are his instincts worse than Obama's or G.W. Bush's? So far, they haven't been.

I'll take a few stomach-churning moments on a stage over another few decades of starvation and crimes against humanity, and living under the Sword of Damocles of North Korean nukes and intentions toward South Korea. At least Trump did something different.

Give it time. It could be the worst move ever, but let's not judge it until we see.

Comments
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napleslover
napleslover

The picture of the American flag next to the N. Korean flag makes me sick. Trump & Kim will use this photo op to their advantage politically while the rest of the world laughs at them knowing N. Korea will never give up their nukes.

streiff_is_a_moron
streiff_is_a_moron

@etbass - I'm pretty sure every branch of military service disagrees with you if you don't think we need 1)SK as a very strong ally 2)bases somewhere on the peninsula for strategic reasons beyond Korea (China) 3)a ridiculously strong defense against NK (especially since they are now nuclear) because NK has always been slightly suicidal in their engagement with the world.

Could the SK army handle NK? Probably. Are American troops an additional deterrent? Absolutely. Ever wonder why they haven't really tested that line?

Having American Troops there has kept the Kim Jongs in line so far. To pretend otherwise is to completely misunderstand what kind of people they are both as leaders and as followers. If Kim Jong Un told his army to cross the border with guns blazing, they would do it. They wouldn't think about the fact that they were all going to die. He hasn't done this because he doesn't want to lose his army. If we left, he'd lose a lot less if he tried something aggressive.

We care about Korea, but we also care A LOT about China. We need bases nearby. You don't get that without giving something in return. Defense of the host country. We need bases in Japan and Korea, otherwise where do you suggest we force project from?

Having troops perform joint exercises gets necessary training out of the way and shows a spirit of cooperation that allies show each other. It's what allies do and have done. What happens in Korea doesn't just stay in Korea and that's also why we're an ally.

I bring up Israel because Israel is honestly a poor friend to the US, while Korea is one of our best. They're both allies and we subsidize them to no end. Israel has nukes (we never talk about them) and is also a complete loose cannon. Kinda like NK. They spy on us constantly, have worked against our elections, worked against the peace process. They have killed our soldiers and demanded we pretend it never happened and have never apologized for it or even offered some reasonable explanation of what happened(USS Liberty). They stir shit up in the middle east instead of being more measured. They're literally the drunk girlfriend who gets you into bar fights and then makes fun of you when you get a tooth knocked out making sure she didn't get her ass beat. They're also incredibly wealthy and could easily pay full price for whatever hardware they want. Yet we throw money at them when they make life difficult for us and never so much as thank us.

Everything Israel stood for or should have represented has been replaced by the very thing that drove it into existence in the first place. We probably have nobody to blame but ourselves, to be honest.

etbass
etbass

@streiff

Israel has nothing to do with South Korea. None of that still explain why they can't defend themselves or why we need military exercises.

NK is substantially weaker. We aren't getting in a shooting war with China. We need their junk and money. They need our purchasing power and technology (that they steal). We don't have to have thousands of troops in Korea to do it.

Israel is the only reliable ally in the middle East. I'm not criticizing people who are protecting their people against terrorist that don't want peace and won't agree to anything short of wiping Isreal from existing and murdering every Jew in the world, no matter how many concessions they make.

I wouldn't honor agreements with terrorists firing rockets at civilians either. Israel isn't our puppet, so sometimes they don't follow orders. That's their right.

streiff_is_a_moron
streiff_is_a_moron

Steve - I suppose this is just one of those situations where eventually you think we'll give in and say "This shit sandwich is delicious! In fact it's the best sandwich I've ever eaten! Hell, maybe the best meal I've ever eaten! I had it all wrong!"?? Not happening. Trump is a failure as a businessman and now we see he's a failure at international diplomacy and negotiations. BIGLY SURPRISE!

He squandered this opportunity completely. Meanwhile KJU comes back with this year's Christmas card photo and a big smile!

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